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As I have insights of the coding I can confirm/specify some of these:

  • Enable Automatic Race Settings: Clarification: If enabled, SAM will morph NPCs according to their race, but there's no default values hard-coded in the mod. Race adjustments must be defined manually in the "Races" tab, otherwise it's all set to 0 (and medium hair textures).
  • Class Offset: Confirmed.¬†If enabled, some hard-coded values of Samson and Sam will be added to the NPC during the morph generation according to their class. The values are hard-coded in the mod, and will be applied after all other criteria.
  • Variation range: confirmed. The variation range it's a delta of values from the race-specific base value. Schlong and morphs values have this multiplied by 10, for textures is taken as it is. It also acts as a "limiter": if you set a race samson value to 50, and the variation range is 1, NPCs of that race will have have their samson morphs ranging from 40 to 60, but it will never be below or over these values. Since the function it's parabolic, it will be more likely that you will have values closer to the one you set (so most NPCs of the previous example will have values closer to 50 and few will have 40 or 60). Same thing goes for textures. If you set a race textures to be "smooth", a variation range of 1 will give them either "smooth" or "light" hair, with a variation range of 2 it goes up to "medium" but you'll never get "hairy" or "furball" textures.
  • Overrides:¬†clarification: morphs and scaling are overrides too. Cleaning the overrides basically resets the NPCs as you never encountered them. Pretty useful if you edit race settings and you don't want to fine-tune everything, or if your savegame starts to suffer from all the datas gathered (specially for random leveled NPCs).
  • Race settings: confirmed. Editing these values will affect only values generated for NPCs encountered AFTER the edit, it's not retroactive. The perfect example od this is Advar/Ralof: when the mod gets activated entering Helgen keep if you set nord the race to have certain values it will not affect the guy you've entered the keep with, since he'll be already set up by the default values (all 0 + medium hair)
  • Texture Lock:¬†confirmed. This is specially useful if you don't want to have a race to get too much/less hairy but keep a high variation range for other values. (i.e. hairy altmer of hairless nords)
  • Cut:¬†confirmed.
  • Werewolf: clarification: the tab works also without MT (works for me and I don't have it), but there's a thing here. The werewolf inherits sam/samson and schlong values from the base actor (i.e. if Farkas has 50 samson, his werewoilf form will have 50 samson) and saved values for the werewolves will carry over (i.e. if you set yourself to have red fur you'll always have red fur). However, werewolves are only recognised as werewolves in their wolf form and humans are only recognized as such in human form. What does it mean? It means that you can't set Sindig's morphs and schlong size in Bloated Man's Grotto (it's a different actor reference than the one you encounter in the falkreath jail) unless you don't use the setpqv SAM console commands (with the related mod), and you can't set Farkas' wolf form's fur and eye color until he transforms. Same goes for you: if you want to setrup your wolf form's options you have to transform first.

Note also that every NPC that has multiple references, like Kodlak or Ulfric, they'll be set up differently every time you encounter them for the first time, so they can end up with different features (i.e. different samson values or different schlong size).

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7 hours ago, Felio said:

Overrides: clarification: morphs and scaling are overrides too. Cleaning the overrides basically resets the NPCs as you never encountered them. Pretty useful if you edit race settings and you don't want to fine-tune everything, or if your savegame starts to suffer from all the datas gathered (specially for random leveled NPCs).

Have you actually tried this? It didn't do anything for me when i tried to use it after editing race settings.

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14 hours ago, Melesse said:

Have you actually tried this? It didn't do anything for me when i tried to use it after editing race settings.

Well, most of the times I used it it worked, but it's skyrim we're talking about. It may happen that to rerun the setup on the NPCs you have around you have to exit and re-enter the cell, or the script doesn't fire or reload the game. It may also mhappen that if you reset a single NPC its overriedis are immediately re-applied as the same because it takes them from the actor tab. If the button was re-purposed, then I don't know when and how.

There's also another factor: the morph generation uses a random factor, and since in scripting random is never entirely random it may happen that in the same zone most people are setup with similar values because the function yelds the same results (i.e. all guards of whiterun or all NPCs of Dragon Bridge). If your edits are not dramatically different from the old values (i.e. you change the average samson of the nord from 0 to 100), you may not notice a difference between the old setup and the new.

Anyway, on the class offsets: the scripts uses "class archetypes" categorizing each NPC class in one of these and giving these hard coded values:

  • Citizen Archetype (Bards, Farmers, Commoners in general): +10 Samuel
  • Famished Archetype (Beggars, Prisoners): -20 on both Samson and Samuel
  • Laborer Archetype (Blacksmith, Lumberjacks, Miners, etc.): +20 Samson, +10 Samuel
  • Mage Archetype (all classes marked as "Conjurer", "Mage", "Necromancers", etc.): -20 Samson
  • Rogue Archetype (All classes marked as "Scout", "Archer", "Ranger", "Assassin", etc.): - 20 Samuel
  • Sloth Archetype (Basically the merchant classes, like "Apotecary", "Vendor" etc.): +20 Samuel
  • Soldier Archetype (All classes marked as "Guard" and "Soldier"): +20 Samson, +10 Samuel
  • Warrior Archetype (all classes marked as "Warrior", "Barbarian", "Vigilant", etc.): +20 Samson

So, basically, if the morph generation for an NPC from the race settings is 50 Samson, 50 Samuel, if the class offset is active the NPC will be 30/50 if it's a mage, 50/30 if it's a rogue, 70/50 if it's a warrior, etc.

As I said, there is no way to edit these values, however I am reworking my SAMPLE mod that was previously on HoT and I have added a MCM tab that makes them editable (Vector himself suggested it once).

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Author of the topic Posted

@Felio Yeah, it's hard to tell for the user what the Override button does and if it even works when you press it. The notion that the button only resets textures comes from the SAM MCM itself. When you select the option, it reads: "This option allows to clear all overrides from all the Actors, so the textures are reseted [sic]". Since textures are mentioned specifically, it makes it sound as if only textures are reset.

I used to think that the button would fix that glitch when textures go black and "twinkle", i.e. look normal or go black based on the angle of the polygon's angle to the camera underneath or something. It doesn't of course, since that's a glitch in NiOverride if I recall correctly.

The class offsets are very interesting, I always wondered how exactly those work and if they stack with the Race offsets.

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3 hours ago, Felio said:

Well, most of the times I used it it worked, but it's skyrim we're talking about. It may happen that to rerun the setup on the NPCs you have around you have to exit and re-enter the cell, or the script doesn't fire or reload the game. It may also mhappen that if you reset a single NPC its overriedis are immediately re-applied as the same because it takes them from the actor tab. If the button was re-purposed, then I don't know when and how.

There's also another factor: the morph generation uses a random factor, and since in scripting random is never entirely random it may happen that in the same zone most people are setup with similar values because the function yelds the same results (i.e. all guards of whiterun or all NPCs of Dragon Bridge). If your edits are not dramatically different from the old values (i.e. you change the average samson of the nord from 0 to 100), you may not notice a difference between the old setup and the new.

Ok, i took a look at the script source, and the Clean all Overrides button only calls nioverride.RemoveAllOverrides() and nioverride.RemoveAllNodeOverrides(). The Clean Overrides button for specific actors only calls nioverride.RemoveAllReferenceOverrides() and nioverride.RemoveAllReferenceNodeOverrides(). All this will do is reset NIOverride, not the Samson or Samuel values, because those are stored separately by SAM_Data. (To be specific, they're stored by calling the native SAM_SKSE function SetFloatValue on the actor.)

The thing is, the GenerateMorph function only ever runs if the script attached to the SAM spell runs while the actor is not in SetupFaction. Since GenerateMorph adds the actor to SetupFaction, and no function in any of the scripts ever removes any actor from SetupFaction, GenerateMorph can only ever run once for any specific actor.

Please tell me if i'm wrong somewhere or if you have a different version of the script where the Overrides buttons remove the actor from SetupFaction or call GenerateMorph again.

Edited by Melesse

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Nope, I think that's it. In fact I used that button only back in the times when I had to uninstall SAM to perform a clean update, then I just left it there.

On the other hand it does what the description does: it cleans the overrides (ALL overrides then, not just SAM's). To remove all characters from the setup faction there should be a function to call all memorized characters one by one and remove them from the faction to run the random morph generation again. It would be easier to uninstall sam, save in a secluded location (better yet in an uninhabited interior cell), perform a save cleaner, reinstalling SAM and setting it up before going out. :|

@Dredd yes they stack and in fact are applied later. As I told you, the variation range serves also as a "limiter" for the Samson/Samuel morphs, but the class offset ignores that.
Say you set up a race with a 50 Samson slider value and a 2 variation range: you'd expect that no character can go less that 30 Samson and over 70 Samson, but with class offset active a warrior with a generated value of 70 from the class offset gets a value of 90, while a beggar with a value of 30 gets instead a value of 10.
Of course the values are checked to stay in the 0-100 range before applying those morphs, so that a beggar with 0 samson won't get a -20 morph, but this means also that characters can have a morphs less than the one expected form their class: if a warrior had, say, a generated -5 samson, the +20 would make it 15. Basically: variety.

Edited by Felio

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@Felio As of now, SetupFaction can be cleared with some console shenanigans ('save [savename] 1' to save a text file with all the save data, deleting everything except npc refids from the text file, adding 'removefac [setupfaction id]' after each refid, running the file as a bat file in game).

But if you're making a mod that affects morphs and has an MCM anyway, might i suggest adding a function to clear the faction? It would be awfully convenient.

@Dredd 'Overrides' refers to morphs, textures and scaling changed by NIOverride only, and cleaning them does not reset the samson/samuel values. Once you clear an actor's overrides, the exact same morph will get applied to them again when the game sees them, usually as soon as you exit the MCM. 

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Thank you for the user guide, very helpful.  Out of curiosity, is it possible to keybind the SOS commands?  Honestly, as someone who played with SOS a couple years ago and now is starting a new game, SAM has essentially 100% of the functionality of SOS, it's just annoying to have to type in console commands to control schlong angle.  Google is not proving super helpful.

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4 hours ago, azriel2012 said:

Thank you for the user guide, very helpful.  Out of curiosity, is it possible to keybind the SOS commands?  Honestly, as someone who played with SOS a couple years ago and now is starting a new game, SAM has essentially 100% of the functionality of SOS, it's just annoying to have to type in console commands to control schlong angle.  Google is not proving super helpful.

The SOS Schlong controller works for SAM, or at least it did last time i used it, which was a couple years ago.

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@MelesseThe thing is, I have no idea how to call all members of a faction without registering them in a formlist or something. If I used the faction itself it would just keep on removing them and re-add them every time we encounter them, and it would make the mod even more script heavy than it is currently.
It would be possible to reset a single actor (i.e. the one in the crosshair) or perhaps add a "rerun morph generation" hotkey, but I think it still would be faster to manually tweak them from the MCM. Also, I have never been able to make the hotkey option in the mcm work properly.

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Hmm, i was thinking of a button in the MCM that would empty the faction (once) when clicked, so that any changes made in the automatic settings would get applied to everyone instead of only new actors. Readding actors on meeting them would be the expected behaviour, and I didn't think it would add any script load, because the script would only run once when the button was clicked.

But it was just a suggestion anyway, i definitely don't know as much as you about papyrus and mcms, and if it would be difficult to implement, i say leave it. I've never seen anyone other than me who wanted to reset SAM in that way anyway, and even if there was someone, they should be able to do it via the console like i outlined above.

Thanks for the discussion in any case <3

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I don't think there is a command to "empty a faction", afaik you should call on each actor that belongs to it the RemoveFromFaction() function which is not quite that easy because you don't have any way to get who's in that faction at a given time.

Basically, since there's no accessible "member list" for a faction though papyrus, the only way is to check if any actor you encounter is in that faction and get him out. Problem is that once he's out of the faction the SAM setup spell would run and put him back in it, so every time you encounter an actor the function would runcausing (probably) all kind of results.

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Author of the topic Posted
On 28.3.2018 at 3:53 AM, bodieacb said:

Is there a way to prevent this from happening? People have suggested to me that I just look in settings and turn on revealing armor, but I think that's just for SOS. It's kinda unsettling to have an empty void where a dick should be

If this happens to be revealing armor made for SOS, you have to uninstall that armor to get rid of this problem. SAM and SOS handle revealing armor differently and this is usually the result.

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17 hours ago, bodieacb said:

The only armor mods I have are SAM vanilla refits, SAM dawnguard/dragonborn, SAM legacy skimpy armors, and SAM vector armors. 

Move XP32 Maximum Skeleton below SAM so SAM gets overwritten by it. That should fix several issues.

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11 hours ago, bodieacb said:

Ok, that did give a lot more of them underwear, but some still have an empty space. I noticed that when I take the armor off, underwear quickly appears, then disappears. Is there a way to just disable the underwear? or is that not the issue. Thank you so much for the help by the way

 

Edit: I've realized that modular armors would probably fix my issue. It won't show up in mcm though.

If schlongs are disabled in the SAM MCM, naked characters will wear underwear. The underwear is basically armor that gets equipped automatically, so it's possible that it needs a moment to appear. If schlongs are enabled, schlongs are equipped instead. Some of the skimpy armors are just underwear, which can be a little misleading (e.g. Guards, Dragonbone and Dragonscale iirc). So, if your guards run around in underwear even though schlongs are enabled, it's because that's their armor.

Apart from that, the missing schlongs could be an aftereffect of XPMSE being overwritten and might only affect your current save file. However, if the problem persists in a new save file, another mod might try to edit the schlongs. The creature framework for example tries to edit the schlongs of all beast races. If you have that installed, you can untick beast races in its MCM and things should be okay after that. If none of that is the case, I'm afraid I don't know what the cause might be.

The modular armors by Vector don't have an MCM. You have to open the meshes in a program called Nifscope and edit them in there. There used to be a tutorial for that, but I can't seem to find it. I will make a new one if need be.

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29 minutes ago, bodieacb said:

All schlongs are fine except those under armors that have kilts/skirts like fur armor without pants. What's weird is that some NPCs have the underwear and some don't. I was just wondering if there was a way to fix the empty void for schlongs under armor, and I think disabling underwear in modular armors will do something. This video is the reason I think that could be the solution. 

 

Whatever the problem is, it wouldn't have anything to do with the modular armors. The only modular armors (in what you have installed) are dwarven, wolf, elven, daedric, and maybe a couple others that I've forgotten... but they don't include fur armor nor the armor in your screenshot. I checked the nifs in the vanilla refit file, and from what I can see the meshes with skirts include underwear in them, to cover up that hole. As to why the underwear in your game are sometimes showing up and sometimes not showing up, I have no idea.

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Not as far as I am aware, but it is rather simple:

  • Get Nifskope
  • Find the mesh you want to modify in the mod's meshes folder
  • There will be a _0.nif and a _1.nif. Repeat the steps below in the same order for both files
  • open the nif with nifskope
  • click on the part you want to remove in the¬†display pane. This will select the part in the tree in the left pane. It should be labelled appropriately.
  • right-click on the selected part in the left pane, select Branch and Remove Branch. This will¬†delete that part from the mesh
  • Repeat for all parts you want to remove, and save the file.

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8 hours ago, Melesse said:

Not as far as I am aware, but it is rather simple:

  • Get Nifskope
  • Find the mesh you want to modify in the mod's meshes folder
  • There will be a _0.nif and a _1.nif. Repeat the steps below in the same order for both files
  • open the nif with nifskope
  • click on the part you want to remove in the¬†display pane. This will select the part in the tree in the left pane. It should be labelled appropriately.
  • right-click on the selected part in the left pane, select Branch and Remove Branch. This will¬†delete that part from the mesh
  • Repeat for all parts you want to remove, and save the file.

OK. Thank you so much. You are very kind. :x

Is it that easy to adapt a completely different armor to a Sam Body? is there also a possibility?

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